"Temporary" Venting Thread V

[tolkienfan]

I don't mean inequality in education so much, but in job, grant, and fellowship opportunities, salary, invitations to speak at conferences, offers of tenure, etc.

There are so many facets to this that I don't even know where to begin. Organic chemistry has always been a "Gentleman's club" - and success in many fields often has a lot to do with one's connections. Most men don't even realize that they're perpetuating this system - but everyone has a tendency to seek out people like themselves.

Though blatant sexism and racism are less common these days, there has been study after study showing subconscious bias against women and minorities. Even women and minorities have these biases against each other!

I see examples of this in my own life too. An offhand comment by a professor here, an assumption made by a student there... together they start to weigh on one's mind. Not to mention the tendency of the media / PR to avoid making visible the women and minorities who have succeeded. For example: https://twitter.com/omearabrian/stat...825601/photo/1

Someday I'll write an eloquent post filled with links and references. I've started it, but there are just so many issues and examples and personal stories that it's hard. I do believe that we are moving in the right direction, but maybe it's because we've come so far that people don't realize that we haven't made it all the way.

[Earniel]

I'm sorry to hear that, Tolkienfan. I'm not in academia myself but I've been reading a lot of stories like yours. It's disheartening indeed.

[Mari]

I meant in my field of work, namely Education (though I teach at a secondary school, not at a uni or college).
Anyway, not nice to experience that.

[tolkienfan]

I'm very glad to hear that equality is the norm in Education - my sister and brother-in-law are about to start looking for jobs in that field.

I wonder how much that has to do with my observation that is often assumed that females will be going into teaching rather than research focused careers (particularly positions with less prestige and lower pay, such as high school or community college). On the flip side, men who vocal about wanting teaching-focused careers are sometimes looked down upon. It's frustrating to have the choice made for you so early - we are only in our first years of graduate school. And to constantly correct your superiors is not very easy, even if is regarding your own vision of your future.

[tolkienfan]

There is also this: http://www.slate.com/articles/double...ty.single.html

With the current structure of academia, if I have children, it is almost certain that my career will suffer. I am terrified that if I have children, I will end up bitter and resentful toward them. I think about this literally every day.

[Earniel]

I can understand the worry, but I think that may be a little premature just yet. Depending on situations you may just end up in a place that does support the mothers in their ranks. There have to be some out there. And most of the time children start out as a decision of two people, you won't have to be alone at this.

[tolkienfan]

That's a good point - there's nothing to be gained by dwelling on what might happen. My husband very badly wants to be a father, otherwise I wouldn't be so concerned about it (I've never particularly desired them, personally). But he refuses to grant any validity to my concerns... IMO he lives in a fairy-tale land

[Earniel]

Ah well, that's something positive right there. If he wants to be a father, he ought to be prepared to shoulder a good chunk of the childcare. That's certainly something to discuss and explore in depth, should the topic arise in earnest. Maybe he'll be a great stay-at-home-dad?

He'll have to work a bit about leaving fairy-tale land, though.

[Mari]

The reason I didn´t go for a career in research, was that I love research, but hate writing all the required papers

But yeah, if your husband wants children so much, while you want to pursue your career, becoming a stay-at-home dad might be a good idea. He can´t expect you to do both.

[Earniel]

Yeah, the publish-or-perish attitude is one of the less attractive sides of sciences and one of the things that guided my carreer choices away from it too.

[tolkienfan]

That sounds like a perfect solution to me, but unfortunately he is not interested. By fairy-tale I mean that in his mind we can both have a stellar, high-paying careers, while being great parents (absolutely no daycare or nanny) and still have time to play video games several hours each night after the kids go to bed. I will have absolutely no problem taking time off work when they are born, and there is no way that he would ever need to. Oh, and this is so certain that we should start trying next year, though we both have several years of school left.

I will stay firm that at least one of us must have a stable job before we have kids. Hopefully by that time he will be prepared to face the real challenges that go along with a family. And hopefully by then my reproductive instinct will have kicked in at least a little bit Cause right now the whole thing just sounds like a nightmare.

[tolkienfan]

Luckily, I love writing papers! There is little more exciting to me than the idea that my work will be useful to the scientific community.

Publish or perish sucks, but it sucks for everyone. I just wish that the playing field was even.

[Mari]

Originally Posted by tolkienfan

That sounds like a perfect solution to me, but unfortunately he is not interested. By fairy-tale I mean that in his mind we can both have a stellar, high-paying careers, while being great parents (absolutely no daycare or nanny) and still have time to play video games several hours each night after the kids go to bed. I will have absolutely no problem taking time off work when they are born, and there is no way that he would ever need to. Oh, and this is so certain that we should start trying next year, though we both have several years of school left.

Wow, that really is quite a fairy tale! I know I want to have kids, but I´ve already started saving money so I can work fewer hours in a couple of years. No way can I work full-time and be a good parent and pay for daycare all at the same time.

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by tolkienfan

That sounds like a perfect solution to me, but unfortunately he is not interested. By fairy-tale I mean that in his mind we can both have a stellar, high-paying careers, while being great parents (absolutely no daycare or nanny) and still have time to play video games several hours each night after the kids go to bed. I will have absolutely no problem taking time off work when they are born, and there is no way that he would ever need to. Oh, and this is so certain that we should start trying next year, though we both have several years of school left.

Oh dear, someone's seriously deluding himself as to what time- and energy-sinks those little humans are. You don't happen to have family or friends that have kids below the age of two that you can babysit for a day or two as trial run? (Most parents will jump at this to volunteer their kids.) That experience ought to cure him of any idea he'll have time to play videogames well into the night after all that. (Yeah right, falling asleep right on the console is more likely! )

[tolkienfan]

Eärniel, that is an AWESOME idea! In fact, I will insist upon it - along with the demonstration that he can get up from his computer and abandon his team during a crucial moment (a "teamfight" for those who play League of Legends) if necessary. This one has been standing for over a year now, and he has yet to pass it

[Alec]

Staying up late to write an essay for school
Its a persuasive, Why you should buy Legos instead of Mega Bloks
Should I post it in the teacup when I'm done?


MSP (Measurement of student Progress) next week
No fun

[Mari]

What does MSP entail? Sounds like some kind of sport designed to torture people

[Alec]

Originally Posted by Mari

What does MSP entail? Sounds like some kind of sport designed to torture people

Measurement of Student Progress.
Its the test to see how smart you are in the state of Washington.
As I said is no fun

[Earniel]

Originally Posted by tolkienfan

Eärniel, that is an AWESOME idea! In fact, I will insist upon it - along with the demonstration that he can get up from his computer and abandon his team during a crucial moment (a "teamfight" for those who play League of Legends) if necessary. This one has been standing for over a year now, and he has yet to pass it

Glad to be of help. If there is anything I've learned since becoming an aunt (so I only get kids in small doses and thank goodness for that ) is that good parenting is not for the faint-hearted.

Maybe for your partner, nothing may bring that home more accutely then a nappy-disaster-that-needs-attending-NAO during a boss-fight.

Originally Posted by Alec

Measurement of Student Progress.
Its the test to see how smart you are in the state of Washington.
As I said is no fun

I can imagine. I can't remember a single test in my school-going years that was particularly fun to begin with.

[Alec]

Sick yesterday and today
No fun.

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